Seduction Is Stupid-The end of the courtship model of dating
From Sexual Supremacy:
“Seduction belongs to historical trivia and folklore, a side note in our history. Robert Greene’s book, “The Art of Seduction” was an entertaining collection of anecdotes, not an instruction manual. Most of the tactics described don’t app ly to modern men. A man with a job, hobbies, friends and family – in other words, A LIFE – doesn’t have time to chase women around, and shouldn’t need to.
We don’t need a generation of pickup artists. We need leaders. We aren’t medieval courtesans trying to win favour with the noble class. Men put women on pedestals, and then try to manipulate and conquer them. This creates a lose-lose situation. The man loses time and integrity, the woman feels used, and both miss the chance to make a great connection.
By definition, seducing a woman presumes she should NOT sleep with you. If you are a leader, women SHOULD sleep with you, as you actually have high social value, and you have the ability to make them feel good. If you are trying to run game, and you spend a lot of time seducing women, you are operating at a very low social level.”
Dating as courtship is just as misguided. The only difference is that seduction is a bit more entertaining and fast-paced, while courtship is expensive and slow. Both are unnecessary, as they are games within the same weak frame.”
From wikipedia:
In colloquial language and fictional literature, seduction is the process of deliberately enticing a person, to lead astray, as from duty, rectitude, or the like; to corrupt, to persuade or induce to engage in sexual behaviour. The word seduction stems from Latin and means literally “to lead astray”.
Courtship is the period in a couple’s relationship which precedes their engagement and marriage, or establishment of an agreed relationship of a more enduring kind. During courtship, a couple get to know each other and decide if there will be an engagement or other such agreement. A courtship may be an informal and private matter between two people or may be a public affair, or a formal arrangement with family approval. Traditionally, in the case of a formal engagement, it has been perceived that it is the role of a male to actively “court” or “woo” a female, thus encouraging her to understand him and her receptiveness to a proposal of marriage.
A courtesan was originally a courtier, which means a person who attends the court of a monarch or other powerful person.[1] The modern use of the term for a prostitute or mistress of a man of rank[2] belies a much more complex heritage.
In feudal society, the court was the centre of government as well as the residence of the monarch, and social and political life were often completely mixed together. Prior to the Renaissance, courtesans served to convey information untrusted to servants to visiting dignitaries. In Renaissance Europe, courtiers played an extremely important role in upper-class society. As it was customary during this time for royal couples to lead separate lives—commonly marrying simply to preserve bloodlines and to secure political alliances—men and women would often seek gratification and companionship from people living at court. In fact, the verb to court originally meant “to be or reside at court”, and later came to mean “to behave as a courtier” and then “to pay amorous attention to somebody”.[3] The most intimate companion of a ruler was called the favourite.
A courtier (pron.: /ˈkɔːrtiə/; French: [kuʁtje]) is a person who is often in attendance at the court of a king or other royal personage.[1] Historically the court was the centre of government as well as the residence of the monarch, and the social and political life were often completely mixed together. A female courtier was called a courtesan, although today this name has come to be associated with female entertainers who served the upper classes (with or without sexual connotations).
Courtship as a social theoryCourtship is used by a number of theorists to explain gendering processes and sexual identity. Scientific research into courtship began in the 1980s after which time academic researchers started to generate theories about modern dating practices and norms. Both Moore and Perper found that, contrary to popular beliefs, courtship is normally triggered and controlled by women,[3][4] driven mainly by non-verbal behaviours to which men respond.
This is generally supported by other theorists who specialise in the study of body language.[5] There are some feminist scholars, however, who regard courtship as a socially constructed (and male-led) process organised to subjugate women.[6][7] Farrell reports, for example, that magazines about marriage and romantic fiction continue to attract a 98% female readership.[8] Systematic research into courtship processes inside the workplace[9][10] as well two 10-year studies examining norms in different international settings[11][12] continue to support a view that courtship is a social process that socialises both sexes into accepting forms of relationship that maximise the chances of successfully raising children. Whilst this may negatively impact women, particularly those seeking independence and equality at work,[13][14] it is argued that the majority of negative impacts accrue to men in the form of shorter life-expectancy, higher rates of suicide, alcoholism, homelessness and imprisonment.[15][16]
“The Script”
(aka the traditional script)
As men who are training to get elite-level results with women and “go beyond dating”, we must flip the script.We need to be aware of, and enact the opposite of the traditional dating dynamic. The traditional script is basically composed of four or five acts.
You see a woman and you put her on a pedestal in your mind. You put her above you mentally.
You walk up or you somehow get in to an interaction with her and you try to impress her.This is a logical strategy to use because if someone is above you, it makes sense that you would try to impress them.Then perhaps she gives you some attention. She maybe sees past your insecurity and your pedestal mentalitybecause that’s not that different from what she’s experienced her entire life. Hell, it’s what every other guy is doing. She’s probably come to expect that and she decides to give you a chance.This, you think, is your big chance to be with an attractive woman – so you get needy and put pressure on her. This could be calling her too much – or even in that first initial conversation being too pushy In terms of trying to force the conversation and maybe even trying to get her to come back to your place before it’s really appropriate, things like that.Act Four is she starts to pull away from you. Now, this could be in a relationship that’s been going on for a while or this could be in the first 30 seconds (i.e. you approach, she gives you a chance, you try too hard to impress her, you get needy, she pulls away and doesn’t want to talk to you anymore.)Now, get this…The next timeyou see an attractive woman you start over at Act One (pedestal mentality). Only this time you’re carrying a lot of resentment and you’re frustrateddue to your failures. You also have the belief that women don’t like you, because that’s been your experience. So you’re starting over with even more insecurity and anger. (women can sense when a guy is used to being frustrated with women and it’s just not attractive)I know a lot of guys who are older or who are really just jaded and stuck in their ways having a very negative view of women – and that’s because they had this experience over and over and over. I don’t want you to be like that. As you get to your older years I want you looking back at all the great experiences you had with women. I want you feeling over all good about relationships and sex and romance – and this is what women want from you too.
“The Pedestal Mentality” – an insidious and destructive poison affecting the neo cortex that we are exposed to nonstop. Its subtle yet all-pervasive nature makes it all the more dangerous.The Pedestal Mentality is something we hear nonstop. Not only in the media but among your peers, among your friends, it’s everywhere. It’s this idea that if a woman is attractive than she is somehow more valuable. And most especially, it’s the idea that if a woman is attractive, than she is somehow more valuable THAN YOU.So you see this on TV. For example, you could be watching Spike TV which is supposedly TV programing geared towards men – for men – and yet look at the ads on that channel. It’s a bunch of guys drinking beer and this hot babe walks in and they’re all like “Oh duuuude, she’s so hot. Oh my god. What should I do?” And then the commercial will be like one of the guys thinking of some ridiculous, clever way to impress the girl. Maybe he’ll open a beer bottle with his tongue and she’s like, “Ooh”.Something ridiculous like that…And basically this is a message saying:“With a woman who is good looking, she’s better than you. You have to impress her or even make an ass of yourself, appeasing her, so that she’ll do you the honor of talking to you. So that she’ll look down at you from her pedestal and be nice to you and maybe even grant you access to her precious vagina.“And that’s basically the message that we get everywhere.Now I think this message comes from two different places.I think one: it comes from you. You get this message from yourself and the things you have come to tell yourself in your thoughts, your buddies have this message, you’re dad has this message, even women have this message. They’re also bombarded with it and they start to believe it. Now get this. There is also a hidden agenda in society from corporations – from companies and individuals that are trying to sell products by making you feel like you’re fundamentally inadequate – by making you feel like women are better than you. These voices imply that the only way you’re going to get laid, the only way women are going to like you, is if you buy This Deodorant, own That Car, have this kind of Haircut, or that you’re super buff, all of the above, or whatever else. Anything that’s trying to sell you something using attractive women leaning against it, or caressing the guy after he uses it, is basically saying women are more valuable than you. The idea that women, just because they’re pretty, makes them higher than you and you must appease them so that they give you the favor of having sex with you. This is the message that men are bombarded with all fucking day, 24/7. The sad thing is. This is wrong. It is not true. Not only is it not true but it’s harmful to you. Not only is it harmful to you, it’s harmful to women. Because do you honestly think that a woman wants to be surrounded with a bunch of pussies who think that she’s better than them? Do you think that women want to date a guy who puts her above himself? Do they want to date a guy who lowers himself and thinks he doesn’t deserve her and is constantly calling her, texting her, checking up on her, making sure she’s not sleeping with some other cooler, more rich, more handsome guy with a better car or a better fucking t shirt or whatever it is. Women don’t want guys to be like that. Women don’t want you to put them on a pedestal. Because it makes you act like a little bitch.A woman doesn’t want to sleep with a guy who is weak and who doesn’t feel he deserves her. So, let’s think about how this applies contextually. Specifically what happens? You see a woman. She’s attractive. That doesn’t mean she’s more valuable. That simply means she has a nice face, has nice features, and you might be interested in having sex with her unless she’s a complete weirdo. If she’s cool enough, you’ll go for it. That’s all it means.But what ends up happening is you see the girl and you get the pedestal mentality. You put her on a pedestal in your mind. That’s the only place the pedestal exists, is in your mind. You put her on the pedestal and then you put too much thought in to what you’re going to say – in a subtle unconscious effort to impress her.
“The Pedestal Mentality” – an insidious and destructive poison affecting the neo cortex that we are exposed to nonstop. Its subtle yet all-pervasive nature makes it all the more dangerous.The Pedestal Mentality is something we hear nonstop. Not only in the media but among your peers, among your friends, it’s everywhere. It’s this idea that if a woman is attractive than she is somehow more valuable. And most especially, it’s the idea that if a woman is attractive, than she is somehow more valuable THAN YOU.So you see this on TV. For example, you could be watching Spike TV which is supposedly TV programing geared towards men – for men – and yet look at the ads on that channel. It’s a bunch of guys drinking beer and this hot babe walks in and they’re all like “Oh duuuude, she’s so hot. Oh my god. What should I do?” And then the commercial will be like one of the guys thinking of some ridiculous, clever way to impress the girl. Maybe he’ll open a beer bottle with his tongue and she’s like, “Ooh”.Something ridiculous like that…And basically this is a message saying:“With a woman who is good looking, she’s better than you. You have to impress her or even make an ass of yourself, appeasing her, so that she’ll do you the honor of talking to you. So that she’ll look down at you from her pedestal and be nice to you and maybe even grant you access to her precious vagina.“And that’s basically the message that we get everywhere.Now I think this message comes from two different places.I think one: it comes from you. You get this message from yourself and the things you have come to tell yourself in your thoughts, your buddies have this message, you’re dad has this message, even women have this message. They’re also bombarded with it and they start to believe it. Now get this. There is also a hidden agenda in society from corporations – from companies and individuals that are trying to sell products by making you feel like you’re fundamentally inadequate – by making you feel like women are better than you. These voices imply that the only way you’re going to get laid, the only way women are going to like you, is if you buy This Deodorant, own That Car, have this kind of Haircut, or that you’re super buff, all of the above, or whatever else. Anything that’s trying to sell you something using attractive women leaning against it, or caressing the guy after he uses it, is basically saying women are more valuable than you. The idea that women, just because they’re pretty, makes them higher than you and you must appease them so that they give you the favor of having sex with you. This is the message that men are bombarded with all fucking day, 24/7. The sad thing is. This is wrong. It is not true. Not only is it not true but it’s harmful to you. Not only is it harmful to you, it’s harmful to women. Because do you honestly think that a woman wants to be surrounded with a bunch of pussies who think that she’s better than them? Do you think that women want to date a guy who puts her above himself? Do they want to date a guy who lowers himself and thinks he doesn’t deserve her and is constantly calling her, texting her, checking up on her, making sure she’s not sleeping with some other cooler, more rich, more handsome guy with a better car or a better fucking t shirt or whatever it is. Women don’t want guys to be like that. Women don’t want you to put them on a pedestal. Because it makes you act like a little bitch.A woman doesn’t want to sleep with a guy who is weak and who doesn’t feel he deserves her. So, let’s think about how this applies contextually. Specifically what happens? You see a woman. She’s attractive. That doesn’t mean she’s more valuable. That simply means she has a nice face, has nice features, and you might be interested in having sex with her unless she’s a complete weirdo. If she’s cool enough, you’ll go for it. That’s all it means.But what ends up happening is you see the girl and you get the pedestal mentality. You put her on a pedestal in your mind. That’s the only place the pedestal exists, is in your mind. You put her on the pedestal and then you put too much thought in to what you’re going to say – in a subtle unconscious effort to impress her.
